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Best tank for killing the New German Light tanks?

New German Lights Spähpanzer Ru 251 Luchs Littlepard SP I C Pz II G

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IrmaBecx #1 Posted 16 February 2016 - 11:43 PM

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Tomorrow early marks the one week anniversary of the NGL line, and since everyone has accepted they are in no way OP, let's talk a little about killing them.

 

What is your favourite tank for countering the NGL menace? Do you have any strategies to share?


Edited by IrmaBecx, 17 February 2016 - 06:31 PM.

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Thirdfoxes #2 Posted 17 February 2016 - 12:13 AM

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Check out the Ace thread - I think a DW2 is an unconventional but nice counter to speedy luchs.  The AP does guaranteed 160 damage and the HE gives you 200 while wrecking their tank.

 

The accuracy and traverse allows you to remain competitive.

 

I've one shotted a few spics and vks in my KV2 also. They do 150 damage to me, I do 900 damage to them...just don't miss ;)



ykohistsni #3 Posted 17 February 2016 - 12:15 AM

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Ramming them, since they are light and don't have much armor. Also when they are speeding, try to track them because, when I speed in my object 140 and get track, the tank turn and expose the weak spot and I find it really annoying.

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IrmaBecx #4 Posted 17 February 2016 - 12:23 AM

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That's quite a game! It looks like the Death Wagen is also the bane of the Pz II Gangsta, the Pz IV Deathbringer and even the Death Wagen itself!

 

I give you it's an unconventional choice, but not a bad one in the least. Traverse is good, and the L/43 has good shell velocity. AP pen is around 25-30mm, correct? My weapon of choice at the moment is the Pz III/IV. The 7,5 L/48 can hit a full speed Luchs directly from the side using the regular auto aim. Fantastic fun. Could use a sligt ROF buff.

 

The "don't miss" part is why I'm not trusting the derp guns to handle this. I think good ROF is more important so you can track them and keep doing damage, I have high hopes for StuG III platoons.


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IrmaBecx #5 Posted 17 February 2016 - 12:25 AM

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View Postykohistsni, on 17 February 2016 - 02:15 AM, said:

Ramming them, since they are light and don't have much armor. Also when they are speeding, try to track them because, when I speed in my object 140 and get track, the tank turn and expose the weak spot and I find it really annoying.

 

Good point! When you hit a vehicle at speed and destroy a track, it will turn in it's place. Happens to me all the time in my beautiful Panthers.

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Dassem_ #6 Posted 17 February 2016 - 12:30 AM

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easy, the best tank for killing a Luchs is another Luchs. The Luchs is also the best tank for killing pziig with!


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Thirdfoxes #7 Posted 17 February 2016 - 12:42 AM

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View PostIrmaBecx, on 17 February 2016 - 12:23 AM, said:

That's quite a game! It looks like the Death Wagen is also the bane of the Pz II Gangsta, the Pz IV Deathbringer and even the Death Wagen itself!

 

I give you it's an unconventional choice, but not a bad one in the least. Traverse is good, and the L/43 has good shell velocity. AP pen is around 25-30mm, correct? My weapon of choice at the moment is the Pz III/IV. The 7,5 L/48 can hit a full speed Luchs directly from the side using the regular auto aim. Fantastic fun. Could use a sligt ROF buff.

 

The "don't miss" part is why I'm not trusting the derp guns to handle this. I think good ROF is more important so you can track them and keep doing damage, I have high hopes for StuG III platoons.

 

And to add - the DW2 will make the Luchs driver think about relocating or picking off eqsier targets (or at least it seems to in my experience). While they're driving around you can push forward and destroy the rest of the team - leaving the luch for last.  No tank, no matter how OP will consistently win 4 on 1 face offs. What I'm saying is - while individually the luchs is strong, if you can mop up the rest of the reds with something equally high powered like the DW2 even unicum players will struggle.

 

When I'm driving the luchs I try and take out the DW2 and Hetzer as quickly as possible as I see them as potential threats, if not to me then to the rest of my team.

 

Also agree that a luchs is also a good counter to the enemy luchs :)



AlSanchez74 #8 Posted 17 February 2016 - 01:02 AM

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The best counters to the new German light tanks are other light or medium tanks with autoloading guns: Cruiser IV, Covenanter, T-46, A-20 etc.  They've got fast enough traverse to cope with a Luchs or Panzer IIG up close, and enough speed to chase one that's running away. Their guns are often a bit lacking in pen, but against light tanks this isn't an issue, and spraying a lot of smaller shells quickly and having some of them hit is way more effective against a small rapid target than firing one massive projectile three times per minute and missing completely. Think "anti-aircraft guns"

 

The massive alpha with long aim time from a DW2 or a Hetzer won't make a mark on a well-driven Luchs that's arriving to CoD them.



IrmaBecx #9 Posted 17 February 2016 - 02:38 AM

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Any thoughts on the higher tiers?

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simon_simon_k #10 Posted 17 February 2016 - 06:39 AM

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View PostIrmaBecx, on 17 February 2016 - 03:38 AM, said:

Any thoughts on the higher tiers?

 

SU-122-44

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PapaSten #11 Posted 17 February 2016 - 06:49 AM

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View PostIrmaBecx, on 16 February 2016 - 11:43 PM, said:

Tomorrow early marks the one week anniversary of the NGL line, and since everyone has accepted they are in no way OP, let's talk a little about killing them.

 

What is your favourite tank for countering the NGL menace? Do you have any strategies to share?

Who decided they are not OP?

unless you have demographics of the whole line and how it performed last week.


 


IrmaBecx #12 Posted 17 February 2016 - 06:56 AM

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View Postsimon_simon_k, on 17 February 2016 - 08:39 AM, said:

 

SU-122-44

 

That was my thought exactly when I watched E_P_I_Cs video where they go kittycat hunting. Why didn't he pick the SU-122-44? Surely it has enough travese, and the frontal armour is better. The SU-85 i has better ROF perhaps?

 

@Thirdfoxes: Completely agree, the best thing you can do with the NGLs is to force them to relocate because when they are relocating, they are not shooting. If you see a lone friendly being attacked, go help immediately. Sometimes a tracking shot is all it takes, and you will get assisted damage. Often, the NGL will break off the attack, but if you are lucky, you will be able to take it out. If it gets away after you hit it, you will have effectively shortened its time in the game.

 

Here's some low-buck math for you. NGL tanks win a lot, but don't survive very often. Hey get killed towards the end when their hitpoints run out. If you take away some of their hitpoints, that will happen sooner. The sooner they die, the less likely they are to win.


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IrmaBecx #13 Posted 17 February 2016 - 06:58 AM

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View PostFourdiesel, on 17 February 2016 - 08:49 AM, said:

Who decided they are not OP?

unless you have demographics of the whole line and how it performed last week.

 

I decided they are not OP. Read my book.

 

They are good tanks, but people are clearly overreacting.


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PapaSten #14 Posted 17 February 2016 - 07:03 AM

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View PostIrmaBecx, on 17 February 2016 - 06:58 AM, said:

 

I decided they are not OP. Read my book.

 

They are good tanks, but people are clearly overreacting.

 

what book?

And if you don't have the statistic of the tank how they are performing I think you can only base your statement with opinions then actual facts.

you may think people are overacting, but probably in statistics they are clearly doing way to well.


 


IrmaBecx #15 Posted 17 February 2016 - 07:13 AM

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View PostFourdiesel, on 17 February 2016 - 09:03 AM, said:

 

what book?

And if you don't have the statistic of the tank how they are performing I think you can only base your statement with opinions then actual facts.

you may think people are overacting, but probably in statistics they are clearly doing way to well.

 

I wrote a book called "Speed Kills! The Definitive Guide to the New German Lights". It's dedicated to Staffman. It's in editing right now. :)

 

Seriously though, there is another thread dedicated to this very question. I will gladly elaborate there. 

 

Can we assume for the purposes of this thread the NGL tanks are not OP? That was what I meant when I wrote everyone had accepted.


Edited by IrmaBecx, 17 February 2016 - 07:15 AM.

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szkaraj #16 Posted 17 February 2016 - 08:41 AM

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Pz III. Fast and well armored. If it would have same gun as Luchs it would be definitely OP.

The easy day was yesterday.


Winston_Smith84 #17 Posted 17 February 2016 - 08:58 AM

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View Postszkaraj, on 17 February 2016 - 08:41 AM, said:

Pz III. Fast and well armored. If it would have same gun as Luchs it would be definitely OP.

 

Yes I agree. I chased down a Leopard in my Cromwell the other evening on Falls Creek. Rammed.Tracked.Shoot.Boom. Your quick but not that quick.

Edited by Birdistheword15, 17 February 2016 - 08:59 AM.


Brawling_Bomber #18 Posted 17 February 2016 - 09:05 AM

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Dunno about shooting the NGL - but did have a head on game of chicken with a Luchs -  only problem for the Luchs was that I was in an Excelsior. :facepalm:

He couldnt pen so he figured he would ram.


Edited by Warren5, 17 February 2016 - 09:06 AM.


 


Thirdfoxes #19 Posted 17 February 2016 - 09:46 AM

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View PostAlSanchez74, on 17 February 2016 - 01:02 AM, said:

The best counters to the new German light tanks are other light or medium tanks with autoloading guns: Cruiser IV, Covenanter, T-46, A-20 etc.  They've got fast enough traverse to cope with a Luchs or Panzer IIG up close, and enough speed to chase one that's running away. Their guns are often a bit lacking in pen, but against light tanks this isn't an issue, and spraying a lot of smaller shells quickly and having some of them hit is way more effective against a small rapid target than firing one massive projectile three times per minute and missing completely. Think "anti-aircraft guns"

 

The massive alpha with long aim time from a DW2 or a Hetzer won't make a mark on a well-driven Luchs that's arriving to CoD them.

 

The hetzer wouldn't be using the HE gun after the nerf but the ap one which I remember was quite fast firing.

 

I just checked and the DW2 has 1.9 aim time and 7 rounds per minute before vents, gun laying drive and rammer.  After the perks it should be close to 8 rounds a minute and 9.5 with adrenaline (a shot every 7.5 secs normally or 6.25 running adrenaline) - not exactly a tardy performer in the gun stats.

 

The problem I see with using the light tanks is that you effectively need to play in the luchs style of run and gun - which is of course viable, but then why not just play the luchs? Even using the mediums the Luchs will pen you (it pens the Matilda and DW2 consistently) so I don't think much advantage will be gained by the extra armour vs loss in mobility.

 

The asymmetrical counter to the luchs is the heavy hitting but quite accurate and nippy heavy like a DW2 (in my opinion).  You also get the additional benefit that it is a heavy tank and while a luchs has to relocate, quite often you can go bashing in against the rest of their team.  Again, emphasising the point that it is a 7 v 7 battle.  A DW2 does needs only be good enough against a Luchs, but great against the rest of the red team to be a counter to the Luchs in my opinion.

 

And I agree with Imra - strategy is key - pair up (at least) so not yoloing is as important as ever as the one tracking shot often means an early trip to the showers for a light tank.

 

...meanwhile in the DW2 you are steadily rumbling fowards and picking the team off.

 

The only issue with the DW2 is if you need to chase a Luchs 1 on 1 then you're doomed. But situation awareness comes in to play here and you shouldn't let it get to a stage where it is one on one (i.e. point about sticking as a loose group).



IrmaBecx #20 Posted 17 February 2016 - 09:53 AM

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Excellent points, Thirdfoxes!

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