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Win Rate is Nonsense: Discuss


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lateo74 #1 Posted 23 March 2016 - 08:23 PM

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If you'd taken years to master an art form, you'd eventually be lauded as an Expert or Master

 

But you wouldn't have to keep justifying all those failed attempts to learn the art form, when you first started out

 

..................

 

So why do we use an contrived 'Career WinRate' value, ultimately (and sometimes fatally) eroded by our initial 'learning curve'? 

 

Isn't a 30 Day, 60 Day or 90 Day WinRate a better value than a Career WinRate?  

 

 



HughDomfok #2 Posted 23 March 2016 - 08:31 PM

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would be better if periodical winrate was measured by amount of battles, instead of time.

Winrate for last 2000 battles would be a good measure.



The_Mighty_Wombat #3 Posted 23 March 2016 - 09:14 PM

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Win rate is just one statistic value, it can be padded or buffed by playing easy tanks.

I look at all their tanks as an indication of what the player is like.

 

 



phony1907 #4 Posted 23 March 2016 - 10:18 PM

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its all about that single battle. Everything else is BS.

If calling for help, follow me, I know how to die!!

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCn4tqTiik7dSnoI6s0UtuMw


Just_merpug #5 Posted 24 March 2016 - 01:37 AM

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View Postphony1907, on 23 March 2016 - 10:18 PM, said:

its all about that single battle. Everything else is BS.

Yup. I have aces (which I may brag about from time to time), in tanks I suck in, decent win rate in tanks I hate, but the key thing is playing one game at a time, as well as you can. 


Denoobing member of the Active Frontline Klan - and proud of it. Be nice to me..https://www.blitzstars.com/player/eu/Chairman_merpug


Rokuro_Okajima #6 Posted 24 March 2016 - 07:14 AM

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Either of the two winrates are only a rough indicator. Going into details (short term wr, platoon rate, dmg r, individual tank results) will give you a pretty good indication what the skill level from a certain player is.

we can start also talking or showing 30 day winrate. Most probably want make a big difference. Career 50% players will be worse than 60% wr players will be worse than 70% players. Just on a higher level...


 

 


TheBerio #7 Posted 24 March 2016 - 08:09 AM

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Win Rate is important stat. But; it's easy to boost with some low tier OP tanks, well, then you need to see more stats like avg dmg, avg tier, avg spot and platoon rate. Personally, platoon rate it's not important, I play usually play only in platoon, becouse teams in nowdays are ...sux. 30 days stats are more important than career stats. Why? Some players (like me) started playing WoT as noobs but they were trying to learn and be better. Evolve. So 30 days stats are showing how does player evolved. 


 

 


SAX0N_WARRI0R #8 Posted 24 March 2016 - 01:00 PM

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Your never gonna have a perfect way of telling how good or bad a player is, over all WR is just an indicator of a players success in there whole time playing blitz , stats for individual vehicles depend on when they had those vehicles, its best to look at all the info on a player and take it as a whole, although if you do need a quick reliable stat I would suggest 30 day WR is probably mose representative of a players current abilities

Titus_Scato #9 Posted 24 March 2016 - 01:32 PM

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Win rate by tier is far more useful than overall win rate.

 

If you look at my stats, you'll see I'm good in Tiers 1-5, OK in Tier 6, average in Tier 7, and bad in Tier 8. 

 

So if I ask you to platoon with me in Tier 5, you'll know I'm reliable.  If I ask you to platoon with me in Tier 8, then you'll probably have to carry me.

 



PapaSten #10 Posted 24 March 2016 - 04:36 PM

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View Postphony1907, on 23 March 2016 - 10:18 PM, said:

its all about that single battle. Everything else is BS.

 

Explain?

I don't seem to understand what you mean.


 


Zoschoen #11 Posted 24 March 2016 - 06:33 PM

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View PostFourdiesel, on 24 March 2016 - 05:36 PM, said:

 

Explain?

I don't seem to understand what you mean.

I think what he means that it's all about the battle you are playing at that moment. You need to do your best at that one. But I could be wrong ofcourse.


 

 


DieJagdkatze #12 Posted 28 March 2016 - 03:45 PM

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Sometimes winrate doesnt mean much. Winrate real value drops if a player uses mostly soviet vehicles or other overpowered vehicles, if he has mostly under tier 8 battles and if he usualy plays in a platoon. Also a low number of battles under 10-15.000 that would suggest a reroll would decrease the real value of winrate.

Sometimes winrate means more. If player uses mostly non soviet vehicles or paper tanks or other underpowered vehicles, if he has most battles above tier 8 and if he didnt platoon 90% of his victories. If he has a high number of battles, over 10-15.000 that would suggest its an original account and not a reroll.

30 days winrate is especially important for original accounts with high number of battles, over 15.000, as those player learned some good skills since they started and that might not be reflected in overall winrate.

 



eliasdepelias #13 Posted 31 March 2016 - 08:27 PM

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It is the only stat that really Matters. Why else play this game but to win? I just played a game where i had a noob team, the reds all good players, and one capped from start. my team Didnt move so i sacrificed my tank, drive through a bunch of reds and did 10 damage from a ram before dying.

My 45% Winrate teammaten then managed to beat a bunch of 55% winraters. 

No stat Will tel you what i did but Winrate.

and Some Will manipulate it, we all do it, Some more then others, but Who cares? 



PapaSten #14 Posted 01 April 2016 - 03:19 PM

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View Posteliasdepelias, on 31 March 2016 - 08:27 PM, said:

It is the only stat that really Matters. Why else play this game but to win? I just played a game where i had a noob team, the reds all good players, and one capped from start. my team Didnt move so i sacrificed my tank, drive through a bunch of reds and did 10 damage from a ram before dying.

My 45% Winrate teammaten then managed to beat a bunch of 55% winraters. 

No stat Will tel you what i did but Winrate.

and Some Will manipulate it, we all do it, Some more then others, but Who cares? 

 

no

 


Warbladex #15 Posted 02 April 2016 - 11:50 AM

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View Posteliasdepelias, on 31 March 2016 - 09:27 PM, said:

It is the only stat that really Matters. Why else play this game but to win? I just played a game where i had a noob team, the reds all good players, and one capped from start. my team Didnt move so i sacrificed my tank, drive through a bunch of reds and did 10 damage from a ram before dying.

My 45% Winrate teammaten then managed to beat a bunch of 55% winraters. 

No stat Will tel you what i did but Winrate.

and Some Will manipulate it, we all do it, Some more then others, but Who cares? 

 

An absolute no.

 

View PostFourdiesel, on 01 April 2016 - 04:19 PM, said:

 

no

 

Agreed.



Dimebag_Barrel #16 Posted 02 April 2016 - 04:55 PM

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View Postlateo74, on 23 March 2016 - 08:23 PM, said:

Isn't a 30 Day, 60 Day or 90 Day WinRate a better value than a Career WinRate?  


Unless you've been playing the same exact tanks forever, your 30/60/90 days winrate reflects how well you're doing in the tanks you've been recently playing

That can go either way - you could play the Luchs for 30 days and you could play the Maus for 30 days - but neither is reflective and thus shouldn't be used.



lateo74 #17 Posted 02 April 2016 - 05:40 PM

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You can't account for people's choice of tanks - whether you choose just one or many in your overall WR score

We all know about stat-padding but unless you had WR multipliers (dependant upon Tier Level wins) you'll never overcome the statistical 'error' (or the perception thereof) of just playing 'that one good tank'

 

This is is why people go for re-rolls to 'cleanse the past' and eradicate the learning curve necessary to get even a 50% WR 

I'm simply saying that career WR statistics are not relective of current day skills.

 


Edited by lateo74, 02 April 2016 - 05:44 PM.


lateo74 #18 Posted 03 April 2016 - 11:27 AM

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More easily said than done when you have a life outside of a computer game
 

If the premise is false why are various sites already using 30 60 90 day WR?


Edited by lateo74, 03 April 2016 - 11:30 AM.


aclz #19 Posted 04 April 2016 - 12:40 PM

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View Postlateo74, on 03 April 2016 - 12:27 PM, said:

More easily said than done when you have a life outside of a computer game
 

If the premise is false why are various sites already using 30 60 90 day WR?

 

I don't think that it's false.  In most cases the 30/60 day winrate is a better indication of a player's skill than career winrate: it's what the career winrate will approach if you keep playing the same way. Can someone give an argument that the WR over the total number of battles is better? While it does include all battles, the player you're evaluating isn't the same player as 12 months ago, so why are the older results important?

 

As for whether WR is in general a good way to measure how good a player is, I don't think so, it's the easiest to manipulate. It's true that there are things that aren't reflected in any other stat than WR, though.



Mockney_piers #20 Posted 04 April 2016 - 01:28 PM

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There is no single indicator of skill.

 

Experienced players look at all stats, career, recent, win rate, spot rate, damage, wn8/wn7, overall, tier averages and per tank, to get a feel for a player.

If they're looking at yours they'll take all your concerns into account, if they're idiots then you have nothing to prove to them and they're not worth worrying about ;)


Edited by Mockney_piers, 04 April 2016 - 01:29 PM.





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