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When to move up to the next tier?

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Just_merpug #21 Posted 20 May 2017 - 03:32 PM

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View Postbladefury_1, on 20 May 2017 - 12:08 PM, said:

A question I meant to ask what's the difference between wn8 and wn7 on blitz stats???

 

Never quite sure. It's harder to make WN7 change colour. Neither is particularly relevant to Blitz,, as the formulae are from PC. Also, with the equipment changes in 3.8 several of the things used to calculate them are going to break more, I think. For instance, if spotting is a thing, then the inability of tanks to have binocs and camo net fitted will cause a major shift in that particular stat.

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MarsIsBrightTonight #22 Posted 20 May 2017 - 10:46 PM

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View Postbladefury_1, on 20 May 2017 - 12:08 PM, said:

A question I meant to ask what's the difference between wn8 and wn7 on blitz stats???

 

AFAIK WN8 is a measure of how good you are doing in a tank, verus the average performance of players using that tank, and it reflects damage.

Whereas WN7 is a measure of how good you are doing in a tank period, and it reflects kills.

So, you're driving a tank that's an utter POS and making the most of it - your WN8 will be stellar but your WN7 not quite so. You're driving a super hyper OP tank - your WN7 might be higher than your WN8 because you kill reds and win battles, but still other drivers of that tank are doing better than you.



bladefury_1 #23 Posted 21 May 2017 - 12:14 AM

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Cheers fella's... that's cleared that up some what.....no explanation on the app... next one I've gotta get my head round is armour inspector...no guides or explanation's in either of em that I can find.... sort of play around and see what's what seems to be the only way...lol..reminds me of the pin a tail on the donkey game  ...close your eyes and hope for the best 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 



sixty_three #24 Posted 21 May 2017 - 01:52 PM

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View PostPrecariat, on 02 May 2017 - 10:26 AM, said:

Any thoughts on when I should move up a tier

 

I think you should be able to give a good answer to this question: "Why should I move up a tier?"

 

When you do jump up a step, you'll be driving a tank you've never driven before.  It'll probably have, taking an optimistic view, level-1 equipment, 75% crew and stock modules.  Soon, you'll be facing vehicles a tier higher, vehicles you've never met in battle before.  The red team will also, on average, be more experienced than you've ever faced before.  The upshot is that you'll probably start losing more, perhaps a lot more battles.  Your teammates may be accommodating, but you'll probably get somebody telling you that you're a moron who should play instead with Lego.

 

There are a lot of sensible reasons why you may want to jump up a level.  More variety, a better skill test, a desire to play a historical vehicle that interests you, etc. No doubt other forumers will be able to suggest other reasons.  The important thing is that it has to make sense to you.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Edited by sixty_three, 21 May 2017 - 01:53 PM.

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Precariat #25 Posted 21 May 2017 - 04:35 PM

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View Postsixty_three, on 21 May 2017 - 01:52 PM, said:

 

I think you should be able to give a good answer to this question: "Why should I move up a tier?"

 

When you do jump up a step, you'll be driving a tank you've never driven before.  It'll probably have, taking an optimistic view, level-1 equipment, 75% crew and stock modules.  Soon, you'll be facing vehicles a tier higher, vehicles you've never met in battle before.  The red team will also, on average, be more experienced than you've ever faced before.  The upshot is that you'll probably start losing more, perhaps a lot more battles.  Your teammates may be accommodating, but you'll probably get somebody telling you that you're a moron who should play instead with Lego.

 

There are a lot of sensible reasons why you may want to jump up a level.  More variety, a better skill test, a desire to play a historical vehicle that interests you, etc. No doubt other forumers will be able to suggest other reasons.  The important thing is that it has to make sense to you.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I guess I have been lucky had more "moron/idiot" comments in tier I/II than tier IV, and directed at the team as opposed to an individual. In fact there is very little chat in battle.

 

The equipment changes will really hit in 3-6 months when the  majority of tanks met in battle will be fully equipped, for now I have been driving around with 0-3 slots unlocked.

Should be more experienced players at higher tiers but I'm not seeing it yet, I see skilled players at tier I/II about as often as tier III/IV.

 

Why, because the tanks handle differently and variety is the spice of life


Edited by Precariat, 21 May 2017 - 04:36 PM.

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Peddy_tanj_it #26 Posted 21 May 2017 - 05:39 PM

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Please forgive me if I seem to disagree with anybody about play styles progression and forgive my foolish noob self in my early games.

 

But what do you want to get out of playing the game ?

 

Some people are happy just to stay around the tier III to V range and never progress up the tiers. Do you want a specific tank ? For me the only thing I wanted to do when I first started was to get that TIGER 1. I did not care about win rates or kills but only the experience points and silver that allowed me to progress as fast as possible to that goal.  Played the game around 18 hours per day. Then I got it and found I was losing all the time. But is was a great tank in WWII stupid game is not working right. ..... 

 

 

Pause use for reflection on what I was doing yep,  I was that bad of a noob. 

 

Prior to the release of 3.8 what I think tended to happen was that the more experienced players tended to group into the higher tiers with tier 8 - 10 being the main places to find them. In the past the level of silver you got for fighting in a tier 10 game did not cover the costs of the fight in repairs and ammo unless you were very good. So what a lot of players did was to buy a good credit earning tank a tier 8 and use that to finance the tier 10 battles. The IS6 was the favoured premium for this. 

 

Because of this the tiers 8 -10 I found were the hardest. 

 

Now with 3.8 things are changing a bit, most of the experienced players are picking a few favourite tanks and fully equipping these. If you have just gone up a tier and run into one of these opponents in a near stock tank you are in trouble. 

 

Occasionally now after 3.8 you get more seal clubbing, which is a experienced player dropping down into the lower tiers 2-5 using a heavily equipped fully crew skilled tank to get easy kills against new opponents. Often in a premium tank. Partly because of the way that the spare parts are dropping and it is far easier and quicker to fully equip a low level tanks rather than the 21 days it takes for a tier 10. 

 

Sorry must stop pontificating and straying off topic. 

 

You seem to have the right idea by gaining skills at a lower level and I agree with the purchase of the 75% crew skills if you are planing on keeping the tank for any length of time. However if you are just racing up the tech tree I would not bother with it below tier 5 by the time you have the experience points required to jump to the next tier only takes a few games and not worth the expenditure.  I would also not pay the gold required to have a 100% crew skill on any tank at any tier. 

 

Remember  that when you do go up a tier that you will generally be facing much better tanks as they are likely to be better equipped and crewed than your own tank.  

 

You will also have to play the tier 4 tanks at tier 3 you will be fighting up against some tough opponents the Matilda can be a really nasty as it is so heavily armoured when you are in a tier 3. Same goes for the Hetzer.  Depending on what you chose I suggest that you take some premium ammo, bought for silver, do not pay gold, to have for these opponents otherwise you have to aim for weak spots and try to get round the back. 

 

But if you like playing at tier 2 you can just stay there. We do not have a timetable in the game that says you must progress to tier 10 after X amount of games. If you want to progress and by your post I assume you do that's fine as well. Just so long as you are enjoying the game. 

 

Good luck and shoot straight. 

 


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Precariat #27 Posted 22 May 2017 - 05:47 AM

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Good points Peddy_tanj_it

 

tl/dr: I asked the question because I was looking for some kind of indication as to when to progress without being too much of a hindrance to my team, that was all really.

 

Just pick any type of tank and each of those will (usually) play differently, some I am poor at and they end-up getting sold, I don't feel compelled to get to the next tier other than want to experience a new tank and learn how it plays.

 

As regard being low tier, it's worse at tier I as you will never have a tier advantage but often will be low tier - frequently the only one. That used to make me annoyed, until I learned I could prevail even against higher tier enemies. You are correct there isn't a magic number of battles that will mean I am ready for a higher tier and I would say that I also meet bad less skilled teams/players at those higher tiers. For me light tanks are the gateway to the next tier, always fun even when I get seal clubbed. That said I tend to perform better in TD as a class.

 

So I will always want to try out a new tank and then drop back down to a lower tier, currently tier II. However a recent tier IV mission encouraged me to pick up the the T-28 (tier IV) which was fun out of the box the cost of a 75% crew is small price to pay at these lower tiers. If there is any correlation between equipment unlock times and crew training costs then this may not always be the case at tiers beyond tier V. It was the equipment unlock times at tier V that shocked me.

 

Yeah Matida in a tier III is a nightmare, just hope your team's tier IV also know this and take it out quickly. I got a Matilda of my own but of course I mainly play lights at that tier (Covenanter is my favourite but I'm grinding the Luchs/A-20 for now). This when I feel the need to play tier IV - bad battles in tier II. Usually the weekends at certain times when I get a string of losses for reasons I can't easily explain.

 

I have learned to accept getting destroyed in stock tanks as a common occurrence at first, I'm still learning at that point. Though it is always a pleasant surprise when I find a tank that is good out of the box, e.g. Marder II, it also plays quite differently to the other TD I have driven

 

Unlike some I don't take it so hard when I get destroyed quickly, I keep an alternate tank I can jump into when that happens. I enjoy when I see an enemy that is playing well, I also try to copy what they do in the future. And who knows what tank I will find that suits my play style at other tiers, ultimately there will be a handful of tanks I enjoy the most and tier will be irrelevant to that.

 

Looking forward to unlocking the famous T-34 soon, and the T-28 leads to the KV-1 doesn't it?


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Just_merpug #28 Posted 22 May 2017 - 08:20 AM

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The T-28 is a great tank. Fugly, but great. A-20, too. I found the T-34 disappointing, much preferred the other meds.

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N00basaurus #29 Posted 22 May 2017 - 09:51 AM

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Played the Cove with the Bofors, didn't like it. One of the two shells in a burst tends to either miss or bounce roughly 35% of the time and the magazine is small compared to other autoguns. Will try it with the standard 2-pdr.

Though I'd rather play the M5 if I want a tier 4 light. Got mashed flat by an [EMRS] sealclubber toon in M5s yesterday (I was tier 3 ;_;.


Edited by N00basaurus, 22 May 2017 - 09:51 AM.

Female crew voicepacks please.

(Re)classify the AMX CDC as a Tank Destroyer.


Precariat #30 Posted 22 May 2017 - 10:40 AM

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View Postmrpgilbert, on 22 May 2017 - 08:20 AM, said:

The T-28 is a great tank. Fugly, but great. A-20, too. I found the T-34 disappointing, much preferred the other meds.

The T-28 seems to soak-up quite a bit of punishment (stock version), I was happier once I changed the gun to the 57mm Zis-8 the A-20 doesn't seem to suit me although I have had some good battles in it. Awww hope the T-34 isn't too bad, maybe the T-34-85 is better?

 

View PostN00basaurus, on 22 May 2017 - 09:51 AM, said:

Played the Cove with the Bofors, didn't like it. One of the two shells in a burst tends to either miss or bounce roughly 35% of the time and the magazine is small compared to other autoguns. Will try it with the standard 2-pdr.

Though I'd rather play the M5 if I want a tier 4 light. Got mashed flat by an [EMRS] sealclubber toon in M5s yesterday (I was tier 3 ;_;.

I got a hit rate of 63.82% (with the Bofors) which is about 0.5% above my average (even with shooting on the move) so I am probably shooting from closer range? At first it seemed slow compared to the other tier IV lights but I do more DPB with it.

The M5 is fun though, it always feel like I have more armour than the Convenanter for some reason.


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N00basaurus #31 Posted 22 May 2017 - 01:05 PM

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63.82% is a bit on the low side. I have 77% in it (admittedly, I have played few battles since I don't really like it) and it's still not as good as it should be. 

 

Tried it with the 2-pdr, ended up in a tier 5 battle and managed to post 2nd damage (830, below the team's KV-1) and 1st XP (720, above the aforementioned KV-1) with 3 reds scrapped. Definitely feels more predictable with the single-shot; hits tend to land where you intended them to: less dispersion and faster aim.


Edited by N00basaurus, 22 May 2017 - 01:09 PM.

Female crew voicepacks please.

(Re)classify the AMX CDC as a Tank Destroyer.


_Ripper4you_ #32 Posted 22 May 2017 - 01:08 PM

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When they get a 1st class or a ace in their top tier tank,always

Precariat #33 Posted 22 May 2017 - 02:00 PM

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View Postvlad9935, on 22 May 2017 - 01:08 PM, said:

When they get a 1st class or a ace in their top tier tank,always

 

iirc I've done that in the first battle with at least 1 tank, depends how bad your team is.

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FixEquation #34 Posted 23 May 2017 - 05:04 PM

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When you can. If it is available, just buy and play. 

Blue_Snail #35 Posted 23 May 2017 - 10:21 PM

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I am new to Blitz, but have years in WoT.

A stat I believe in is the dmg ratio.  (dmg caused / dmg recieved)

I consider a tank that has a dmg ratio greater than 1.0 to be acceptable.

At the end of a battle, I look to see if I caused more dmg than my own hit points.

 

I recommend to new players that the fastest way to improve is to join a clan that does a lot of platooning.

It is much easier to learn from experienced players.

 

Being rather experienced when I came to Blitz:

Day 1, got into a clan.  I knew I really needed mentoring about the new interface.  :child:

Day 2, got onto Discord and had a clan mate begin to show me maps and get advice on which tanks to grind first. :justwait:

Day 3, got my first tier 4 tank, A-20.  However, it is stock now and I am credit poor.  :facepalm:

PS: All this was done without using any gold or free XP.

 

This is not normal.  However, I am really pleased that I found a good clan here - one which suited my personality.

 

 


Edited by Blue_Snail, 23 May 2017 - 10:35 PM.


 


Precariat #36 Posted 24 May 2017 - 04:58 AM

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View PostBlue_Snail, on 23 May 2017 - 10:21 PM, said:

I am new to Blitz, but have years in WoT.

A stat I believe in is the dmg ratio.  (dmg caused / dmg recieved)

I consider a tank that has a dmg ratio greater than 1.0 to be acceptable.

At the end of a battle, I look to see if I caused more dmg than my own hit points.

 

The problem with this is a DR of 1.0 is relatively easy for anything with a high damage gun (e.g.) but harder for tanks with low pen/damage. I'm not sure there is a one stat fits all approach that works consistently.

 

 


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Blue_Snail #37 Posted 24 May 2017 - 07:33 AM

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View PostPrecariat, on 23 May 2017 - 11:58 PM, said:

 

The problem with this is a DR of 1.0 is relatively easy for anything with a high damage gun (e.g.) but harder for tanks with low pen/damage. I'm not sure there is a one stat fits all approach that works consistently.

 

 

 

I agree about one stat not fitting all.  And this dmg ratio is imperfect, since it does not include spotting dmg.  It was simply a stat I could easily "grasp".   Also, my thinking is still oriented to the habits I developed in WoT.  I am still in the process of adapting to the Blitz environment.  The interface is different here and information is presented in a different format.  I still struggle with such simple things like accepting a "friend" invite.

Fortunately, I've been lucky to find a good clan right away.  The guys are really helping me to figure out a lot of the technical details.

I must admit that I was getting a bit burnt-out in WoT.  I'm having fun with the new maps here, an the "fur ball" nature of the encounters.  Plus I'm one of those folks who enjoys low and mid tiers.



 


Just_merpug #38 Posted 24 May 2017 - 11:19 AM

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View PostPrecariat, on 24 May 2017 - 04:58 AM, said:

 

The problem with this is a DR of 1.0 is relatively easy for anything with a high damage gun (e.g.) but harder for tanks with low pen/damage. I'm not sure there is a one stat fits all approach that works consistently.

 

 

 

View PostBlue_Snail, on 24 May 2017 - 07:33 AM, said:

 

I agree about one stat not fitting all.  And this dmg ratio is imperfect, since it does not include spotting dmg.  It was simply a stat I could easily "grasp".   Also, my thinking is still oriented to the habits I developed in WoT.  I am still in the process of adapting to the Blitz environment.  The interface is different here and information is presented in a different format.  I still struggle with such simple things like accepting a "friend" invite.

Fortunately, I've been lucky to find a good clan right away.  The guys are really helping me to figure out a lot of the technical details.

I must admit that I was getting a bit burnt-out in WoT.  I'm having fun with the new maps here, an the "fur ball" nature of the encounters.  Plus I'm one of those folks who enjoys low and mid tiers.

 

blitzstars.com gives a nice visual rating of how you're performing in relation to the rest of the sample it uses, on 30/60/90 days or all time. Some people prefer wotbstars.com, but it doesn't scale properly on mobile/tablet, so not me.

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Precariat #39 Posted 02 June 2017 - 11:41 AM

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So I think I have answered my own question now. Of course I reserve the right to completely change my mind on this in the future :D

 

I would say that WR is a good indicator for me. I still want to get 100 battles on a number of different (types) of tank before moving on up. I did this with all 6 tier I and I'm about to reach 7 with tier II and I feel about ready to move to tier III. I think I would want to get at least 5 tier III into the top 10 before committing to tier IV. Currently I just do the x2 battles with tier IV that I am researching (including unlocking the tier V) but my focus is tier II/III. Oh and sometimes I just want to drive my tanks with stupid amounts of armour (Pz.Kpfw. 38H 735 (f) & Valentine II) usually when I get a string of less than stellar team mates.

 

Of course I might reach a tier where I cannot get many/any tanks into that top 10, currently (50.35% minimum, but I've got 2 at over 60%.) All non-premium currently though I got a couple that might be included before too long.

 

What kind of WR might be considered not sucking at the higher tiers (VI+)? And how many battles in a tank before you decide it isn't for you. I've ditched the UC 2pdr and D1 as being unlucky for me (i.e. my WR is <50% in those after a combined 100+ battles)

 

I don't focus on damage as it seems to vary depending on the quality of your team mates, for the record I get quite a few 400+ damage games in my Cruiser III which I feel is decent, on the other hand I get some 1k damage games in some tier IV but don't feel I am playing them well :confused:

 

My hit rate is slowly increasing and I feel this may also be important at the higher levels (currently 64.69% and increasing at about 1% per week).


Edited by Precariat, 02 June 2017 - 11:43 AM.

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sixty_three #40 Posted 02 June 2017 - 03:31 PM

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View PostPrecariat, on 02 June 2017 - 11:41 AM, said:

1. So I think I have answered my own question now. Of course I reserve the right to completely change my mind on this in the future :D

 

...

 

2. And how many battles in a tank before you decide it isn't for you.

 

3. I've ditched the UC 2pdr and D1 as being unlucky for me (i.e. my WR is <50% in those after a combined 100+ battles)

 

 

1. In light of new facts of course... ;)

 

2. At T5 I first tried the Churchill I.  I stuck at it for 19 battles before abandoning the attempt, with a WR of 31%.  I had assumed it would perform similar to the Matilda, but it wasn't as bulletproof. By 19 battles I still needed almost 10k of XP to unlock the top gun, which others on this forum say transform this tank.

 

I then tried the Stug III, thinking it would be rather like the Hetzer.  Again though I sucked at playing it, but this time I persevered and grinded out all the modules.  At 52 battles my WR is an under-par 40%, though it is starting to click.

 

Lastly tried the AT 2.  This clicked much faster than the Churchill or Stug. In hindsight probably because I was getting more used to the new opposing tanks and higher skills from my opponents? My WR in it is now 54%.

 

3. Eventually you can have fun denoobing these vehicles! :child:

 

 

 


Edited by sixty_three, 02 June 2017 - 03:33 PM.

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