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ATGMs are coming back


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Titus_Scato #21 Posted 14 November 2019 - 03:46 PM

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View PostReplicant_2, on 14 November 2019 - 02:24 PM, said:

 

That's a shame, I was really chuffed that of all the posts, mine has made it to the top spot as the most useless one. But maybe you're right, my posts are like my blitz game, mostly harmless and often useless.

Re testing, may I? really? I promise I won't touch HE on the A-20 but I might try to sneak through a 4s reload on the FCM pak (or 400 alpha, the death star of tier III). Oh the giggles if suddenly everyone wanted to drive it.

And I can't believe that in over two decades in software development I have never used that line on my customers.

 

On topic though, before you accuse me of outright trolling.

Guided missiles are all about hitting the enemy without them being able to hit back, I can see 2 main scenarios here

- a brawl, bunch of heavies busy bouncing shots from each other, spotting is not an issue and a missile tank can just sit in a safe spot and keep dropping bombs into the mix

- the arty scenario, a stealth scout does the spotting while the missile tank delivers messages of peace and love etched on the warheads. There's an issue here, there are almost no scout tanks in TIX and TX. In TIX battles you may get some TVIII lights to do the job but otherwise it's all heavy steel out there. Can we expect some light lines coming to high tiers any time soon?

 

One mechanic that I'd like to see would be that after the tank fires, camera switches to on-board view from the missile, it could be then guided long range around a mountain however for the duration of the flight the tank would be left vulnerable. Was it the first "desert storm" when the US started to used on-board video from smart bombs as a propaganda tool?

This, however might be impossible to balance, for one, missiles should not be allowed to spot but there are many more potential issues. Anyway, a fun thought.


Good post.

 

I'm happy with camping missile tanks shooting missiles across the map onto enemy targets for huge damage.  Lots of fun!  Provided their reload is really, really slow.  Like, Death Star slow.  3 shots a minute, max.  Fire, big boom, wait 20 seconds, fire again.

 

Or alternatively, hit and run.  Dash in, fire, big boom, run away for 15 seconds, dash back in, fire again.

 

A definite NO NO to missile camera view though.  These aren't modern tanks we're driving, even the newest of them are around 50 years old.  Small TOW missiles with TV cameras in the nose haven't been invented yet.  That kind of thing belongs in a different game with modern tanks.



Buckleyteer2 #22 Posted 14 November 2019 - 04:06 PM

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By the time I get to them they would have been mastered to hell and then nerfed !!!

EndToast_LOCA #23 Posted 14 November 2019 - 08:08 PM

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View PostReplicant_2, on 14 November 2019 - 03:24 PM, said:

 

That's a shame, I was really chuffed that of all the posts, mine has made it to the top spot as the most useless one. But maybe you're right, my posts are like my blitz game, mostly harmless and often useless.

Re testing, may I? really? I promise I won't touch HE on the A-20 but I might try to sneak through a 4s reload on the FCM pak (or 400 alpha, the death star of tier III). Oh the giggles if suddenly everyone wanted to drive it.

And I can't believe that in over two decades in software development I have never used that line on my customers.

 

On topic though, before you accuse me of outright trolling.

Guided missiles are all about hitting the enemy without them being able to hit back, I can see 2 main scenarios here

- a brawl, bunch of heavies busy bouncing shots from each other, spotting is not an issue and a missile tank can just sit in a safe spot and keep dropping bombs into the mix

- the arty scenario, a stealth scout does the spotting while the missile tank delivers messages of peace and love etched on the warheads. There's an issue here, there are almost no scout tanks in TIX and TX. In TIX battles you may get some TVIII lights to do the job but otherwise it's all heavy steel out there. Can we expect some light lines coming to high tiers any time soon?

 

One mechanic that I'd like to see would be that after the tank fires, camera switches to on-board view from the missile, it could be then guided long range around a mountain however for the duration of the flight the tank would be left vulnerable. Was it the first "desert storm" when the US started to used on-board video from smart bombs as a propaganda tool?

This, however might be impossible to balance, for one, missiles should not be allowed to spot but there are many more potential issues. Anyway, a fun thought.

 

To my main point, nothing is perfect and yes there are some mistakes in every update but why not help finding and fixing them?



Mjr_Eazy #24 Posted 14 November 2019 - 08:36 PM

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View PostEndToast_LOCA, on 14 November 2019 - 08:08 PM, said:

 

To my main point, nothing is perfect and yes there are some mistakes in every update but why not help finding and fixing them?

Er, why don’t WG do their job properly and test it themselves?

Oh! and when was the last release we could actually help do their job for them?

 

 


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Replicant_2 #25 Posted 14 November 2019 - 09:22 PM

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View PostTitus_Scato, on 14 November 2019 - 03:46 PM, said:

I'm happy with camping missile tanks shooting missiles across the map onto enemy targets for huge damage.  Lots of fun!  Provided their reload is really, really slow.  Like, Death Star slow.  3 shots a minute, max.  Fire, big boom, wait 20 seconds, fire again.

 

One problem I have with this is that unlike with conventional guns, the missile tank is guaranteed to remain unspotted as it will remain behind a hard cover all the time.

Sure, one can play the spotting mechanics to remain hidden when firing a gun as well, be it due to distance or clever use of camo and bushes but it's not quite the same. 

Luckily it doesn't look like actually hitting something around an obstacle will be that easy, or at least it's not supposed to be. 

As RibbleStripe says, should probably wait and see, in the worst case we can just play tier V (i-IV are dead and barely playable, VI-VII infested with fantasy OP tanks - I know, I spent last half year grinding almost all tier 6 tanks)

 


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Evil_B #26 Posted 14 November 2019 - 09:34 PM

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Tier V is great at the moment. No abuse, No nastiness, No ego's, No winrate obsessed maniacs! Just us happy players, having fun in a good choice of tanks :)

Chairman_merpug #27 Posted 14 November 2019 - 11:20 PM

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View PostEvil_B, on 14 November 2019 - 09:34 PM, said:

Tier V is great at the moment. No abuse, No nastiness, No ego's, No winrate obsessed maniacs! Just us happy players, having fun in a good choice of tanks :)

Except for those of us trying to ace the Strv coming up against Nightmares and the newly buffed Littlepard... Especially seeing as the ones on my team camp whilst the red ones rampage around the map. 


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EndToast_LOCA #28 Posted 15 November 2019 - 10:06 AM

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View PostMjr_Eazy, on 14 November 2019 - 09:36 PM, said:

Er, why don’t WG do their job properly and test it themselves?

Oh! and when was the last release we could actually help do their job for them?

 

 

You can participate in every single OT of upcoming update



O_o__O_o__O_o #29 Posted 15 November 2019 - 12:12 PM

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how can i get access to that ?
im happy to help with testing because seems like no one at WG is doing it before releasing update
even worse when issue  is found after update no one replies to you or even admitted about it

llo1 #30 Posted 15 November 2019 - 01:11 PM

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View PostO_o__O_o__O_o, on 15 November 2019 - 12:12 PM, said:

how can i get access to that ?
im happy to help with testing because seems like no one at WG is doing it before releasing update
even worse when issue is found after update no one replies to you or even admitted about it


why bother? It's not as though WG will ever take into account anything that you have done in the testing as they have been previously asking for testers, but he releases simply do not show that the testing outcomes have ever been noted, never mind applied!



RibbleStripe #31 Posted 15 November 2019 - 06:16 PM

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Here's FAQ based on initial feedback after the announcement.

 

Why are you adding missile tanks?
Missile Exercise event was one of the most memorable events of Blitz's history because of unique mechanics. Lots of players liked an opportunity to hit enemies with guided missiles a lot and we have been receiving request to bring ATGM back after the event. We've never abandon an idea of ATGM and now it's time to add researcheable vehicles with missiles.
 

ATGM will break the game!!!
ATGM mechanics has passed a number of internal tests and we already can claim that hitting targets with missiles is quite difficult and few players will do it effectively. Also we are going to test new tanks in real game conditions and make a final decision considering the results. This is why ATGM might be adjusted or even not added to the game.
 

ATGM tanks are simply not giving any chances to the enemies in the video you showed during Twister final! So we'll see the same in the battles!

We've created short and spectacular video to demonstrate what ATGM can do. It doesn't mean that every player will perform like this in every battle. So please consider that video as a movie trailer.
 

You are actually bringing arty to the game! Haven't you told before it's not going to happen?
Comparing ATGM to arty is not reasonable at all. Arty mechanics is completely different - you can't shoot through the entire map above buildings and rocks. Keep in mind that there's no camera on the edge of the missile. You control it using the standard camera on tank. This is why it won't be possible to guide missile avoiding a number of obstacles (Alpenstadt town for example).
 

Tanks' roof has very thin armor. Missiles will devastate tanks from above.
Let's not forget two vital things here. There will be no auto-aim and there will be no camera on missile. So hitting enemies right in the turret top might be easy only in theory. But in fact it will require pretty much experience, skill and luck.
 

If it's so hard to use ATGM why are you adding this mechanics? Whom do you make this game for?
Yes, it's not easy to use ATGM. But new tanks will have regular shells providing classic gameplay. Also ATGM is quite situational ammo type which will and should be useful only in certain cases and only for those who mastered this mechanics. Using only ATG in battle will give you nothing but lower efficiency.
 

What ammo types new tanks will have?
APCR (basic), ATGM (premium) and HE. 
 

Will T49 have ATGM?
No, only new tier 9 and 10 tanks will be equipped with ATGM.



Chairman_merpug #32 Posted 15 November 2019 - 06:21 PM

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Any time I've tried to test changes on the test server, on the rare occasion it's been available to us, the few players on there have been incompetent Russians taking advantage of the availability of the high tier tanks they haven't got yet. The pre-5.5 low tier testing was a classic example. Not entirely sure what the point of having the high tier tanks in there was at all.

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Mjr_Eazy #33 Posted 15 November 2019 - 08:41 PM

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View PostEndToast_LOCA, on 15 November 2019 - 10:06 AM, said:

You can participate in every single OT of upcoming update


How?  Last message in the Open Testing topic was March!

Where are the details on the testing of the last 3 releases?


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Black_Wolf_Ja #34 Posted 15 November 2019 - 08:57 PM

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You can't partecipate at all, i asked some time ago to the support if i could take part in the testing of the chinese TDS, they literally responded that only people with value could partecipate to the testing (community contributors and stuff), so no, unless they make a topic regarding the testing of the new mechanic, we can't take part.

However i might be wrong, if someone knows how to download the test server, i'd be happy to know as i would like to test the new incoming stuff, and i do agree that somehow the test servers are also filled with incompetent people that only want to play Tier Xs.


Also i'm happy to hear that these tanks have APCR instaed of HEAT as standard ammo, sure they lose more penetration over distance, but at least it's easier to get a damage + tracking shot if aiming correctly instaed of wasting a shot for no damage at all, and yeah the HE will add their bit of fun too, the missiles being the premium ammo is the right thing to do in my opinion, i was worried that these things would've had missiles as standard ammo, making it very hard to perform well ingame.

However, being a new type of premium shell, i just hope that it won't have reduced damage, as you said, it's hard to use and it has to penetrate a tank to do damage, as i believe it's not something that explodes on impact, but i think that the missiles having 640 alpha could be the way, 550 is just meh for a shell so situational, but hey you can always change the alpha damage after all.


Edited by Black_Wolf_Ja, 16 November 2019 - 12:23 AM.

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Toulgar #35 Posted 15 November 2019 - 10:50 PM

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I have seen many players asking for new grind lines..
I have seen many players asking for new events.
I have seen many players asking for new crew talents.
I have seen many players asking for bigger maps, 10vs10 games.
I have seen many players asking for better graphics.

Do you know how many players i have seeb asking for ATGM? Zero.
Most of players hate even standard T49. And even T49 fans hated T49ATGM.
And you decided to bring ATGM tanks permenantly? Bravo...


 

romsitsa #36 Posted 16 November 2019 - 11:15 AM

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Who needs a missle when the standard ammo is 152 mm AP. On a light tank.

 

A



Replicant_2 #37 Posted 16 November 2019 - 11:57 AM

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View Postromsitsa, on 16 November 2019 - 11:15 AM, said:

Who needs a missle when the standard ammo is 152 mm AP. On a light tank.

 

A


and it will probably have ammo rack capacity of 60-70 shells.


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Titus_Scato #38 Posted 16 November 2019 - 04:21 PM

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View Postromsitsa, on 16 November 2019 - 11:15 AM, said:

Who needs a missle when the standard ammo is 152 mm AP. On a light tank.

 

A

 

That's why it needs to do big damage.  More than the 152 mm HEAT on the T49.  Like 640 alpha instead of 560.



EndToast_LOCA #39 Posted 16 November 2019 - 04:34 PM

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View PostBlack_Wolf_Ja, on 15 November 2019 - 09:57 PM, said:

You can't partecipate at all, i asked some time ago to the support if i could take part in the testing of the chinese TDS, they literally responded that only people with value could partecipate to the testing (community contributors and stuff), so no, unless they make a topic regarding the testing of the new mechanic, we can't take part.

However i might be wrong, if someone knows how to download the test server, i'd be happy to know as i would like to test the new incoming stuff, and i do agree that somehow the test servers are also filled with incompetent people that only want to play Tier Xs.

 

View PostMjr_Eazy, on 15 November 2019 - 09:41 PM, said:


How?  Last message in the Open Testing topic was March!

Where are the details on the testing of the last 3 releases?

 

View PostO_o__O_o__O_o, on 15 November 2019 - 01:12 PM, said:

how can i get access to that ?
im happy to help with testing because seems like no one at WG is doing it before releasing update
even worse when issue is found after update no one replies to you or even admitted about it

 

There is a difference between testing new tanks like the VK (Tier X), Progetto (Tier VIII) etc. and participating in the open test. Regarding the first option, you have to be in a top clan as only players from there get the opportunity (not everybody). And to the second kind of test, all you have to do is create an account on the CIS server play few battles and that's it. Then you can participate and potentionally hunt some bugs. And I am sure everybody can take screenshots and use the Google Translate and/or get in touch with with one of the admins to report a bug :)



Mjr_Eazy #40 Posted 16 November 2019 - 05:46 PM

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View PostEndToast_LOCA, on 16 November 2019 - 04:34 PM, said:

 

 

 

There is a difference between testing new tanks like the VK (Tier X), Progetto (Tier VIII) etc. and participating in the open test. Regarding the first option, you have to be in a top clan as only players from there get the opportunity (not everybody). And to the second kind of test, all you have to do is create an account on the CIS server play few battles and that's it. Then you can participate and potentionally hunt some bugs. And I am sure everybody can take screenshots and use the Google Translate and/or get in touch with with one of the admins to report a bug :)

pfffff  
:facepalm:

yeah right, I bet you’ve not done it


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